Fucking Machines

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CindyOnHeels
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by CindyOnHeels »

Hello, i was reading an interesting topic about fucking machines on this forum (here: /forum_posts.asp?TID=6128) and wanted to reply, but it is closed . we also have a fucking machine. Much like the one described by Peter Sub here /forum_posts.asp?TID=6128&PID=56216#56216, the top image. my Husband build it and improved it somewhat over time. It has proven a lot of fun .  But i would like one with a different kind of design. Because our kind of machine always fucks in the same predictable way. You can vary the stroke and the speed, but that's pretty much it. i'm not really complaining, I love a good solid fuck , but i've seen other machines that i like and reeeaaallly would like to try. One of them is the shockspot (check shockspot.net), but it's waaaayyy over budget  . i think it looks and works kind of like a pneumatic cilinder, but is electric. The beauty of it is that it can move with any stroke and any speed at any time. Hubby has looked for such a device, but hasn't found one that's fast and strong enough. we're not sure where to look. Does anybody here have an idea where to get such a thing? Or maybe build it ourselves, using a spindle (whatever it is, talk to Hubby...). Another idea is to use a steppermotor that doesn't rotate fully. It looks exactly like the one from Peter Sub I mentioned before, but instead it turns back and forth quickly, allowing different strokes and speeds. Anyone experience with these kind of things? Know where to get these electric pneumatic-like cilinder-piston things . Would really appreciate any help or pointers. Thanks in advance. greetz, cindy   

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

Welcome Cindy!I've recently come across a great group on Fetlife that focuses on F-machines and their construction.http://fetlife.com/groups/390That being said, I do happen to own a shockspot so I can answer any questions you and your hubby may have on it. One machine I've seen as of recent that impressed me was the HugHer machine. http://hugher.net/ It's like the Shockspot but a bit more versatile as far as programs go. While the Shockspot can only adjust on a per-stroke basis the HugHer can do things mid-stroke, like speed up or slow down, or even stop halfway for a moment before continuing. They will soon be releasing an add on module that will let you integrate other things to it such as TENS units and pretty much whatever your kinky mind can come up with. It is, sadly, no less of an investment than she shockspot but remember that the engineering that goes into these is pretty impressive and the quality is top notch. These machines will likely outlive you if properly treated.The machine that you have already fits the mold for about 90% of the commercial machines on the market. What may help out a lot is having you and your hubby sit down and come up with a 'wish list' of what you'd like your dream machine to be able to do. Once you have your design criteria, then finding a prebuilt machine or building your own becomes easier since you can start narrowing down your choices.The more advanced commercial machines (such as the shockspot and hugher) use linear stepper motors that are controlled by a pc or microcontroller. Pretty technical stuff for your average DIY, but if you're savvy it's a place to start. Pneumatics are another popular choice but they present their own set of technical challenges. They are much less expensive however and are a good 'bang for your buck'. The fiddly bit will be how you control it to get the motion you want, and finding the right sized air cylinder. Owning a decent air compressor is a must if you're going down this route. Something that'll output at -least- 100psi and has a pressure regulator that you trust.~Meranamerana2011-07-28 10:31:28

CindyOnHeels
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by CindyOnHeels »

Hi Merana,Thanks for your reply! I've joined FetLife right away, it's a very nice site :-), thanks for pointing it out. The fucking machines group is really interesting!My husband is very good with software, even for microcontrollers, and also pretty good in electronics stuff. He's not your average DIY :-P, but I might be slightly subjective ;-).It's the mechanics part that is most challenging :-). But the challenge is part of the fun.And I do have a wish list. It should be able to move as flexible as the hugher. I think a max. stroke of 8-10" is enough. I don't yet know exactly how much force it should have, as I have no idea what the numbers mean in real life. I didn't know about the per-stroke limit of the shockspot, but that's definitely a no-go. However the shockspot looks much better then the hugher IMHO, although I prefer functionality over looks in this case ;-).Pneumatics are not really an option, at least for me. To much noise and hassle, as far as I can see.Controlling stepper motors appears to be easy enough, as he already has a few ones running. He can control the speed and direction very precisely. I can almost see it working as part of a fucking machine :-P. Now he only needs to find a strong enough motor for the job.Biggest problem is the mechanics part, connecting the motor to some form of lineair action. One option is to use a stepper motor instead of the normal motor in our current machine and make it only turn back and forth shortly, instead of full turns, just enough to make the rod go in and out. Another option is to use a rack and pinion (hope that translated ok :-P) that runs along the rod and the motor drives a gear that turns shortly like the first option, but directly driving the rod. Even more options exist, using spindles and belts and such. As I've seen used in CNC machines. But putting that together seems harder than the first 2 options.Any experiences or thoughts about these kinds of drives is much appreciated.greetz, cindy

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

Not a problem Cindy,The shockspot that I have is the one with the 12" stroke length and let me tell you, that's -more- than plenty from what I've found. The biggest problem is finding a dildo that's long enough to use all that! The Vac U Lock ones seem to top out at around 6" which is pretty effective, altho I've been contemplating making my own that are longer, if just to watch my sub squrm.The type of steppers that they both use are 'linear steppers' which from what I understand are pretty much a self contained CNC setup akin to a threaded shaft and ball screw type deal but all enclosed. If you manage to figure out what motor that the hugher or the shockspot use please let me know! I'm trying to divine that myself. I've got a thread going in that fetlife group about my attempts to increase the functionality of the Shockspot system.[Quote=Shockspot.net]17.535 pounds of thrust (push force) 105 inch-pounds (in-lbs) torque equivalent for a 12 inch rotary machine [/quote]As far as force goes, the shockspot site gives some numbers for theirs and that's -PLENTY- for just about any type of play you could want. Unless you're making fruit smoothies with your nethers, you're not going to be able to stop that much force.If your hubby knows his way around microcontrollers, looking into the DIY CNC community for hardware information might not be a bad idea, since this sort of machine is so close to a 1 axis CNC machine it's not funny. And with one of those type of setups, turning it into a 2 axis machine is childs play. (of course, you dont have to have the 2 axies running crosswise like the CNC folks do.)The HugHer developers post in Fetlife quite a bit, and are -great- about customer support from what I've seen. I've learned a lot from talking with them about my issues with the shockspot. If looks are a concern, there's nothing stopping you from building your own machine to resemble the Shockspot. I will say that the astetics of it are very nice, especially if you like the industrial look. (I do!)~Merana

hugher
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by hugher »

Hi guys!Cindy:"Another idea is to use a steppermotor that doesn't rotate fully"- This will not work, see below for explanation."I think a max. stroke of 8-10" is enough"- WAY enough, but then the HugHer also allow to set the "depth" of strokes. Hummm... Think of it as a way to have the same length of stroke but at a different depth. Much usefull with a bound subject "Controlling stepper motors appears to be easy enough, as he already has a few ones running. He can control the speed and direction very precisely"- Controlling acceleration is very important too. Then things get much more complicated if you want to change whats happening between point A and B (in and out) in realtime. This is in fact what needs to be done to go beyond the classic "in-out" motion and create some truly unique patterns (ala HugHer) "However the shockspot looks much better then the hugher IMHO"- Well, I agree that some prefer the shiny metal of the shockspot. I've first designed the HugHer for functionality but I'm now improving the look too. I'm in fact now selling a redesigned model that I believe looks better than the one showing on the website. I'll update the website as soon as I will have time do do it."... although I prefer functionality over looks in this case ;-).-   Agreed! Thank's.Merana:"If you manage to figure out what motor that the hugher or the shockspot use please let me know!"- Tsssss , STEPPER MOTOR!  (In both cases). But the drive mechanism....hummm...- What stepmotor precisely? ... see below"Originally posted by Shockspot.net17.535 pounds of thrust (push force) 105 inch-pounds (in-lbs) torque equivalent for a 12 inch rotary machine"(Or: How to give misleading informations by applying mechanicals concept to non applicable mechanism.)- Based on my knowledge of stepmotors as well as the weight and size of the shockspot I'm pretty sure that the shockspot is using a size nema 23 stepmotor, with a rating of 280 oz-inch approx. Such a motor will then produce a (true) torque of 17.5 inch-pounds (NOT 105 inch-pounds!!!). This is btw about the same motor as for the "Jive".If you connect such a motor to a rack and pinion of 2" diameter you will then have a mechanism able to produce a push force of .... 17.5Lbs !How they came up with 105 inch-pound??? They in fact "twisted" the math by applying the torque concept to a linear displacement.This is highly technical but let's say that a motor could produce a "twisting" force of one pounds at one inch, it will then need to be 6 times stronger to produce the same "twisting" force at 6 inches. This is similar to the lever principle but apply to rotation.By extending this to let's say a 36 inches rotary machine one could then say that this is theequivalent of a whopping 315 inch-pounds !!!This is plain misinformation. The true fact is that a given motor have a give torque that will NOT change, whatever you do with it. Comparing both the shockspot and the HugHer Tango may suggest that with an impressive 105 inch-pounds of torque it is 2.5 times more powerfull that the Tango. The fact is that the Tango is using a 835 oz-inch  (same as 52.8 inch-pounds). Which is a motor that is 3x as powerfull as the shockspot!!! This is a nema34 motor that will NOT even fit inside the shockspot, and this is also why the Tango is about twice heavier as the shockspot...Really think that I should revise my website now."If looks are a concern, there's nothing stopping you from building your own machine to resemble the Shockspot."Seriously thinking about replacing the tripod stand with 80-20 alu stand. Maybe very soon!

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

Hey there JP, glad to see you joining us![quote="hugher"]Seriously thinking about replacing the tripod stand with 80-20 alu stand. Maybe very soon![/quote]T-slotted extrusions like 80-20 are fantastically versatile. Plus adding to them DIY is as simple as dropping in a nut and bolting on. Plus they're sleek and sexy looking.One of my gripes with the shockspot stand is that adjusting the arms is fiddly at times. Plus the type of hinge locking mechanism that they're using can drift if it's not cranked down seriously tight. I'd look into using something a bit more sturdy if you can for adjustment.merana2011-08-02 14:18:21

CindyOnHeels
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by CindyOnHeels »

@J-P: please don't change your design based on my opinion. We just like the industrial look, but that doesn't mean everybody does. Providing an option for tripod, alu or whatever could be a great idea, if more people request it. We looked at several machines and made a 'make or buy' decision early on. Building our own machine is not directly my first choice, as I just want to be able to use it . But given the pricing of the machines (that are any good), there is just no way of buying one. $2000 - 2500 is just too much. I understand that a lot of research goes into developing these things, but knowing what the parts cost.... Of course, it's not fair that my husband (or anyone else) can put one together (given some tinkering ) and write the software himself. For us this is time spend, not money spend, but still a cost. Hubby already ordered a nema 34 motor , so that looks good. He also ordered a few other parts, to play with and put together in a few different ways. Can't wait to see the results .

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

Sounds to me like you've got a solid plan there Cindy. Do us a favor and keep us posted on how your hubby's new project progresses and turns out. It'll be educational! And I do agree with you, the cost involved in the higher end machines is -far- more than just the parts. A large part of what you're paying for is the man-hours of design and development to make them the top end shiny toys that they are.If you don't want to spend that much and you have the technical knowledge and skill to do it, by all means roll your own. But if you'd rather have a working machine -now- and don't want to spend the time debugging/coding then spending the money isn't a bad choice. It's all a matter of $/effort.

hugher
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by hugher »

[quote="merana"]And I do agree with you, the cost involved in the higher end machines is -far- more than just the parts. A large part of what you're paying for is the man-hours of design and development to make them the top end shiny toys that they are.[/quote]Well, while I agree making some profit selling the Hugher, this is the essence of any business. That being said, it's not "far more than just the parts". The parts are in fact a substantial portion of the cost.Just to mention some of the highest price ticket:- Nema 34 stepper motor : $160- Encoder: $55  (Yes, the Hugher is a closed loop design)- Driver: $125   (Hint: Gecko)- Indexer: $145- Slide and drive mechanism: $140- Stand: $100- Power supply: $55- Housing $35 Then there are all those little "parts" that are adding up on top of that. For instance there are 3 pc boards that cost about 12$ each (Yes, this is the price to pay for small scale production ).Then everything need to be assembled, and some parts needs to be done in-house. In my case I'm using a CNC router and believe me this is not a cheap tool by any definitions. All this takes time, lots of time do do a good job.Just for comparison, open an erostek 312 then open the remote control for the HugHer. You will be surprised to find that the remote control has much more parts (including 2 microprocessors) and is a much more complex device.Would I make my own 312? Probably not. Why? Because I know how the 312 feel good, I'm not equipped to do so, and I don't want to spend the time required to try to imitate it.This being said I have absolutely no problem knowing that someone want to make is own fucking machine. Those who know me well are aware that I'm more than willing to help most of the time. I also recognize the fact that a 2200$ machine is not for everyone, then some could just not resist to do thing themselves On that subject Cindy. A good way to start would be to use a driver with an integrated indexer. The Slo-syn SS2000D6i  (by superior electric) is a good choice. I've in fact started to develop the HugHer with it. The price for a new unit is prohibitive (>2000$) but you may find used one on e-Bay for 150$ or less these days. The idea here is that this will be MUCH easier to program than to start with a "plain" microcontroller. For instance the SS2000D6i has integrated accel and decel functions and interface directly with an encoder, which save a lot of time. The biggest problem I've had to solve with it is the fact that it has only 1 analog input that need to be multiplexed if you want to have 4 pots (time, speed, length, depth) like the hugher. Just tell me if you want to go this route. I'll try to find my original design for you.[quote="CindyOnHeels"]@J-P: please don't change your design based on my opinion. We just like the industrial look, but that doesn't mean everybody does...[/quote]+[quote="merana"] T-slotted extrusions like 80-20 are fantastically versatile.... One of my gripes with the shockspot stand is that adjusting the arms is fiddly at times. Plus the type of hinge locking mechanism that they're using can drift if it's not cranked down seriously tight...I'd look into using something a bit more sturdy if you can for adjustment.[/quote]=  Well, given this problem I seriously need to find out if there are other ways to make angle adjustment with those nice looking extrusion Cheers!hugher2011-08-05 03:22:51

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

The big trouble comes with the use of the hinge joint itself being used for the friction lock.While it makes for a very clean look, it's trying to counter the full weight of the motor/shaft assembly on the end of the arm. Of course this acts like a great big lever so the friction lock ends up having to support -more- than the weight of the motor assembly. It's one of the main drawbacks of the jointed arm style support that they use, the other being the risk of pinched fingers. (ouch!)Truthfully I'm not sure which mounting option would be best. In the end it becomes a tradeoff between how flexible the mounting is and how sturdy it is when it's mounted.My own inclination is to keep a vertical support beneath the center of balance of the motor assembly like the HugHer has, but put some form of angular adjustment at the top of it. The drawback of this method becomes the height adjustment, which is pretty important for a retail machine.The modification I'd make to the Shockspot's design to make the hinges more sturdy would be using pivot brackets on either side of the hinges (such as 80-20's 40-4424 bracket). However these are big and bulky and quite a bit more 'industrial' than the sleek look it has now.

hugher
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by hugher »

[quote="merana"] My own inclination is to keep a vertical support beneath the center of balance of the motor assembly like the HugHer has, but put some form of angular adjustment at the top of it. The drawback of this method becomes the height adjustment, which is pretty important for a retail machine.The modification I'd make to the Shockspot's design to make the hinges more sturdy would be using pivot brackets on either side of the hinges (such as 80-20's 40-4424 bracket). However these are big and bulky and quite a bit more 'industrial' than the sleek look it has now.[/quote]The tripod stand of the Hugher have (infinite) angle adjustment. Actually a very good system that doesn't slip easily as the hinges of the shockspot does. Sadly this would be very hard (and expensive) to adapt them to a 80-20 structure.The main thing about the tripod stand that I would like to improve is that it doesn't go as low as I would like it to go (but could go very high). That's the main drawback of using a tripod stand but then this is for now the most efficient and versatile mount I could think of.About the shockspot, could you tell me the size of the extrusion. I believe it is 1.5" sq but want to make sure.

merana
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by merana »

They're using a standard 40mm extrusion. If you're looking to stay with English units, then the difference between that and a 1.5" extrusion is negligible.I think that their system would work better if they weren't using the shaft/motor assembly front mounting position for their main connection point. Something around the midpoint would probably be easier to manage.

hugher
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by hugher »

Cindy,Just found that there is a SS2000D6i warpdrive for sale on e-Bay. This is item number 260829954123. It's gonna be there for 6 days.

hugher
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RE: Fucking Machines

Unread post by hugher »

Merana,Thanks for the info. I'll see what I could do.

Shandy
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Re: Fucking Machines

Unread post by Shandy »

Good afternoon all.

New to the site but wanted to share my experience. I have built a couple using cams and mechanical designs although these normally are bulky especially if you want variable stroke length.

Stepper control does seem to be the way to go but my issue with attempting this is the shockspot has a quoted 23.62 inches per second.

Most steppers operate at a maximum typically 1000rpm. The ball/lead screws typically have a pitch/lead of 2mm.

2mm per rotation at 1000rpm is 2000mm per minute or 78.7 inches per minute which is 7.9 inches per second! 😔

Even using a lead screw with 5mm pitch and a stepper capable of 1200rpm only gives you 3.94 inches per second.

Can anyone shed some light on how they get such linear speed out of the stepper motor? Thanks.

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